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Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 12:39 pm Post subject: Advice needed
Just been checking on my Savannah monitor, and he seems a bit out of sorts.
I did have an incident last week, where I accidentally dropped the box of crickets in his enclosure, and all of them escaped.
I did retireve what I could, but a good portion of them burrowed under the subsrate and hid in his wood.
I know this is my fault, and I should of took more time to actually remove the excess crickets, but I figured he'd just eat them at will.
What I believe has happened is he has either gorged himself to a point where he is struggling to move, or he has impacted himself.
The stats for the tank are 85 ambient, 75 cool end, 120 for the basking spot. He has a hide in the middle, a water bowel for drinking, and one for bathing. He has a Reptisun 3.0 UV (under instruction from the reptile shop, I would of preferred to use an 8 ). All the crickets are supplemented with calcium in the form of nutrabal.
I have just tried to soak him, but he didn't seem to have the strength to hold his head above water. He does look very bloated at the moment, but seems to be alert, and breathing ok. He just seems to be struggling to walk.
Any advice much appreciated. If his condition is no better tomorrow, I will book an appointment at the vets.
Joined: Mar 25, 2005 Posts: 1354 Location: Denver, CO
Posted: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:48 pm Post subject:
I've only been through 1 impaction with my Argentine, well after I stopped feeding in the enclosure, however I believe he may have been wiping his face in the enclosure after eating, picking up the scent of the food, than eating the substrate "Repti-bark".
He was very bloated, lethargic, had no appetite, and was not really drinking much water either adding to the problem - He basically would drink water from a spoon I would put in front of his mouth.
I basically was soaking him twice a day, and had added like a 50% mix of pedialyte to the water to help rehydrate him - It took about a week and a half of this to get him to pass all the bark, but it passed in 3 poop sessions, so don't feel bad if he don't go the 1st time.
I did take him to the vet for an enema, however he had passed all the bark prior to the enema which produced no bark.
Keep soaking him and keep him hydrated - I've heard of others using higher basking temps for monitors, however your temps seem reasonable to me and if you have not had any other problems before with digestion - than I would leave them as be...
A gentle massage during the soaking sessions around the stomach area may help to loosen things up as well...
Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2005 12:40 pm Post subject:
Unfirtunately, I was unable to get him into the vets until Monday, so still keeping him on a fluid only diet for the time being. He is still very swollen, but he's a lot more perky, and responsive, and seems to be regaining his strength. I will still take him to the vet regardless, just for a general checkover, because I have since found out he was wc, not cb as stated on the tank in the pet shop (this is the second time this has happened at the same shop !!!)
Could well just be a parasitic infection or something I guess, although he has now made a full 2 weeks without defaecating.
I'll post up the results, or anh change, as I get them.
Unfirtunately, I was unable to get him into the vets until Monday, so still keeping him on a fluid only diet for the time being. He is still very swollen, but he's a lot more perky, and responsive, and seems to be regaining his strength. I will still take him to the vet regardless, just for a general checkover, because I have since found out he was wc, not cb as stated on the tank in the pet shop (this is the second time this has happened at the same shop !!!)
Could well just be a parasitic infection or something I guess, although he has now made a full 2 weeks without defaecating.
I'll post up the results, or anh change, as I get them.
They screw you over once, it's their fault, you let them screw you over again and its your fault.
However, I am sorry to hear about the sav, and the stress that you must be going through, I hope everything works out but please next time if you want to shop there, be prepared for that "CB" animal, to be WC.
Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 11:34 am Post subject:
The first time I was verbally told my chameleon was cb, which is extremely unusual for a Fischers Chameleon as I only know of a handfull of people who have bread them in this country.
I however didn't realise this until afterwards, so I rang the shop, and the guy who owns it said they were definately wc. In this instance, the tank was clearly labelled cb Savannah monitors, which is not unusual in this country, as there are many breeders around. Apparently, this guy no longer works for them anyway, due to complaints, suprise suprise.
So yes, I do agree, it was my fault for not checking, but I am by no means responsible for this.
Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:13 pm Post subject: ***UPDATE***
Hi Folks
Just got in from the vets, thought i'd update you all.
A combination of 2 things have contributed to his ill health.
1) Calcium deficiency.
Judging by the xray pictures, he was quite possibly well on the way there before I got him, despite looking totally healthy. Basically, from xay pictures, the only prominent contrasting area is his teeth. Everything else is very 'milky' in contrast to the grey areas. You can barely see his back legs on xray. Vet expalined all the possibilities, right through to genetic disorder.
The following drugs have been supplied
* 1 bottle critical care powder - used as a basic feed.
* Lactulose solution - 0.05ml a day
* Zolcal-D calcium and vit D supplement - 0.05ml per day
2) Impaction.
This has occurred, hard to say whether it's caused by the calcium issue, or the cause of it, but nevertheless, he's impacted.
The vet has supplied a bottle of olive oil containing Rocatrol, measured at 1 drop per week, to help loosen the blockage. The blockage did look quite calcified on the xray, as it showed up bright white, yet the only thing I can suggest for the impaction is a pinky fed a day or two before the problems began.
Anyway, his condition is thought to be severe, so time and care are the only way forward now.
Sorry to hear about your monitor. Many if not most shops label stuff as CB or CF when it ain't. I've been using a shop in Sheffield called the SnakeShop, which sells almost exclusively CB, much of it bred locally.
Shops like Wharf Aquatics and Sheffield Exotics always have loads of WC stuff in. They don't like to have empty tanks, so they keep it coming to keep them filled, rather than waiting for CB material.
And I don't know of anyone in the UK producing CB savannah monitors anyway. Despite years of being around the reptile hobby, I've never seen a breeder selling any. Funny that the shops are so good at finding them eh?
Which vet did you use? I've not found one who knows anything about reptiles yet....
Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:32 am Post subject:
Suprisingly, you hit the nail on the head there. Wharf Aquatics. There was a time when I would defend that place to the hilt, but it has gone way downhill, they now employ kids, and to be honest, most of the adults seem to know fek all about anything, not even the fish they have made their name from.
In result, I have decided to never buy another animal from them again, coz they so far have all been either ill, incorrectly labelled, or the wrong advice on care has been given. NAME AND SHAME !!!
Anyway, the vet I use is called Ambivets at Heanor in Derbyshire, which is a fair way from yourself, but the guy called Paul really seems to know his stuff. Last night I was there until around 9.30pm, long after he should of gone home, and he spent about an hour exclusively dealing with myself and my monitor.
There number is 01773717780. He also works late on Mondays, so you should be able to get yourself there after work.
Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:34 am Post subject: Re: ***UPDATE***
drfish wrote:
The vet has supplied a bottle of olive oil containing Rocatrol, measured at 1 drop per week, to help loosen the blockage.
The olive oil may indeed help with the impaction, but the Rolcaltrol is for the calcium and secondary parathyroid issues associated with the deficiency.
Good luck. Sounds a hard road for the lizard......... _________________ Alan
Yep, its a shame that these shops can't get their acts together. I am now very careful about where I go, and buy direct from breeders much of the time. I even bought some geckos from a so-called breeder who listed them as CB. When I got them home they were behaving like WC, I challenged him, and he said that he had picked them up from a friend and understood that they were cb, but as he had't bred them himself, he couldn't say for sure. What a load of bo_locks!!!
I hope you are able to turn things around for your monitor.
Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:01 pm Post subject:
Fingers crossed, I have a good feeling he'll be ok.
Girlfriend is on daytime duty with him, occassionally moving him in and out of the basking spot. I have also dropped the UV down to almost floor level, to help with the absorption of the UV.
Apparently though, he has been trying to dig down today, which I think is a good sign, as he must be regaining some energy.
I'll keep this updated until such a time as he is fit again, or he snuffs it.
Joined: Mar 07, 2005 Posts: 328 Location: Chesterfield, UK
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 1:18 pm Post subject: Great news
Hi again folks
Well, it seems the hard work and expense are paying off.
Stage 1 complete. impaction cleared. He has literally within 5 minutes of having the olive oil, passed a solid white mass, about the size of the end of your little finger, not bad for a 10" lizard. Anyhow, the swelling has subsided a little, and he now has almost full range of movement from all his legs.
Fingers crossed, I think I have this one in the bag now. He's going to the vets again monday for another xray, to see if the calcium is mineralising in his bones.
Expect update late monday evening, or mid afternoon us time.
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